DBN Exclusive with Barry Shuck: Alex Mack talks wrestling, losing seaons, Kyle Shanahan and more

25 questions with a former offensive line favorite

Sometimes, being a champion and really good at one sport prepares an athlete for being superior in his eventual career sport.

This was the journey in the life of Alex Mack.

Mack had a knack for wrestling. He had a compact body structure, was strong, smart, learned quickly, and never learned to quit on anything.

RELATED: FORMER BROWNS CENTER ELECTED TO COLLEGE FOOTBALL HOF

He attended San Marcos High School in Santa Barbara, California, just outside of Los Angeles. Mack played and loved football but wrestled all four years of high school. They say champion wrestlers make the best offensive linemen, and with Mack, that rang true. He lost only two matches his senior year and reached the state finals as he placed second at the CIF state championships in 2003 and was named the 2003 Wrestling CIF-SS Masters Meet MVP.

He also compiled a 4.2 GPA and an 1180 SAT score.

Mack was a three-time All–Channel League selection in football, playing both ways at center and defensive line, 2003 San Marcos football MVP, 2003 Channel League defensive co-MVP, three-time all–Santa Barbara County honors, two-time All–CIF Southern Section, and selected to PrepStar’s All-West team.

As much success as he had in wrestling and his football accolades, he was only rated a two-star recruit in football. He had offers from California, Northwestern, UCLA, and Stanford.

He chose the California Golden Bears and would make 39 consecutive starts.

Mack (6’-4”, 311 pounds) would become only the third player to become a two-time winner of the Morris Trophy, an honor given to the Pac-10 conference’s most outstanding offensive and defensive lineman. He was also a finalist twice for the Rimington Trophy, awarded to the nation’s top center. In-house, he won Cal’s Brick Muller Award for being Cal’s most outstanding offensive lineman. The following season, he was Cal’s co-offensive MVP and was honored with the Schlessinger Coaches Award, which recognizes outstanding athletic ability, academic success, and community service.

In his college career, Mack registered 256 key blocks/knockdowns, 32 touchdown-resulting blocks, and 29 downfield blocks as a three-year starter.

As a sophomore, Mack was named First Team All-Pac 10. In his junior campaign, he was again pegged First Team All-Pac 10 as well as First Team All-American. As a senior, he was was only called for two penalties in 832 snaps, voted to his third consecutive First Team All-Pac 10 nod along with being selected Second Team All-American. He received an invitation to play in the prestigious Senior Bowl.

After the 2008 season led to a 4-12-0 record, Cleveland Browns head coach Romeo Crennel was let go and Eric Mangini replaced him.

At the time, Crennel’s offensive line consisted of rookie LT Joe Thomas, LG Eric Steinback, C Hank Fraley, RG Rex Hadnot, and RT Kevin Shaffer. Mangini replaced QB Derek Anderson with QB Brady Quinn.

In the 2009 NFL draft, Cleveland owned the fifth overall pick. The Browns traded its first-round selection to the New York Jets for the Jets’ first-round pick at #17 plus their second-round selections (52nd overall). The Jets then selected QB Mark Sanchez of USC. When the #17 pick rolled around, the Browns again traded down with the Tampa Bay Buccaneers and got their pick at #19 plus a sixth-round pick. The Bucs then took Kansas State QB Josh Freeman. Now drafting at #19, again, Cleveland traded down with the Philadelphia Eagles, who sent the Browns their #22 pick plus a sixth-round spot. The Eagles chose WR Jeremy Maclin of Missouri.

Finally settled, with the #22 pick in Round 1, the Browns chose Alex Mack, center, University of California Berkeley.

By trading down, Cleveland has passed on two blue-chip offensive linemen in Andre Smith of Alabama and Virginia’s Eugene Monroe. In the end, neither would be named to a single Pro Bowl – Mack was voted to seven.

Mack played for the Browns for seven seasons, then the Atlanta Falcons for five years, and then a single season with the San Francisco 49ers. In his 13 seasons, Mack was named Second Team All-Pro three times, named to seven Pro Bowls, voted to the PFWA NFL All-Rookie Team, and later selected to the NFL 2010s All-Decade Team to represent that decade’s top center.

Not bad for a two-star prospect.

Oh, and one more thing. Mack played in 196 NFL games and started 196 games. He had 9,848 offensive snaps for three clubs. He did have some injury issues, but if he suited up, he started.

After his rookie deal expired in 2014, the Jacksonville Jaguars signed an offer sheet of a five-year contract worth $42 million for Mack. The Browns had five days to match that offer, which they did. In Week 6, he was carted off the field against division foe Pittsburgh Steelers with a broken fibula. Two years later, Mack voided his contract with $24 million left on his deal, thus making himself a free agent.

Mack then signed a five-year, $45 million contract with the Atlanta Falcons, including $28.5 million in guaranteed money. That season, the Falcons played the New England Patriots in Super Bowl LI. It was the first time in Mack’s career that he participated in any playoff game, much less played for the league title.

During his NFL career, Mack remained relatively durable. In addition to the broken leg, he missed Week 16 of the 2020 NFL season due to a concussion ending a streak of 90 consecutive regular-season starts. He was placed on the reserve/COVID-19 list that same season. He played in Week 5 of the 2011 NFL season with appendicitis and had an appendectomy during Cleveland’s bye week, then started the next game. Later, he broke the same leg and played in the Super Bowl with it taped up.

On June 3, 2022, Mack retired after 13 seasons in the NFL. He was voted to be inducted into the College Football Hall of Fame class of 2025 with an upcoming ceremony. It was his first year on the ballot. In 2023, his former high school retired his #65 jersey. He has also been inducted into the San Marcos Athletic Hall of Fame (2024) and the Santa Barbara Athletic Round Table Hall of Fame (2023). While with the Browns, he was a fan favorite, despite Mack not playing on a single winning team.

Today, Mack lives in Los Angeles, California, with his wife Rachael and their daughter.

Dawgs By Nature’s Barry Shuck was able to catch the busy Mack to find out what happened to the Falcons in the Super Bowl, why Joe Thomas’ Hall of Fame ceremony was so special, and what the reason was for Mack to void out three years’ worth of a valid Browns’ contract.

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DBN: At San Marcos High School, you played center as well as on the defensive line where you had eight sacks and 93 tackles. When colleges recruited you, which side of the ball did they want you for?

Mack: I was just a small-town recruit. Santa Barbara doesn’t have the best in terms of football. Cal only wanted me because I had gone to their summer camp and had practiced for them. UCLA wanted me to play defense.

DBN: You wrestled all four years. Folks don’t understand in a wrestling match, this is the toughest three minutes of your life. Some have said you lost only one match as a senior, while others say it was two matches. The truth?

Mack: Two matches, to the same guy. I lost to him in the finals of a big tournament, and then I lost to him in the finals at State. Wrestling is not a fun sport.

DBN: How does the sport of wrestling help you once you decide to stay on the offensive line?

Mack: I cannot speak high enough of how wrestling prepares you as an athlete. It’s the combination of a team sport like football and an individual sport like wrestling that was a good upbringing. You get to work with other people, and you can’t point a lot of fingers when you don’t do well. It’s directly on you. But I realized if I worked hard to have it pay off, it was certainly valuable.

DBN: At Cal, you made 38 consecutive starts. You were nominated for the Draddy Trophy, which is awarded to the college football player with the best combination of academics, community service, and on-field performance. It’s like the academic Heisman. How did you respond when you found out that you had won this award?

Mack: That was a good experience and a cool event. They invited me out and flew me to New York. I was sitting in this room with all the other finalists and realized just how many great athletes I was up against. It was cool to be there, but I was the most unlikely to be the winner. Our athletic director told me the night before I was one of the finalists, so be sure to have something ready to say. I was shocked and honored, but at least I was prepared instead of standing there gaping. I was totally surprised. My coaches showed up.

DBN: In 2009, you were ranked the best center in the draft when Cleveland took you at Number 21 in the first round. Weren’t you thinking about leaving Cal a year early?

Mack: The year before, I felt like leaving early and applying to the NFL. They offered a pre-draft analysis. It came back a fourth round assessment. I thought I was better than that. It would have been cool to leave early, but you only have one chance. I had also broken my right thumb that past season, so I had played with that issue and just played through it. Felt I didn’t play as well as I should. So, I made the choice to stay another year and had a whole year to work on some stuff. We had a better season and beat our rival Stanford. And winning the Draddy. It was totally worth it.

DBN: What was your first Browns’ training camp like?

Mack: I had a pretty rough training camp. Pretty miserable. They had (nose tackle) Shaun Rogers at the time. He is a very special player. I was unprepared for that combination of size, skill, and power. The coaches threw the world at us. Mangini wasn’t exactly the easiest coach. It was definitely trial by fire. I remember it being so tough I sat in my dorm room one day, and I wrote down the “pros” and “cons” of quitting football. That is how miserable training camp was. It was non-stop grind you down. I didn’t feel like I needed it. I pushed through it and got over it. I wish I had kept that sheet of paper. George Warhop was the offensive line coach and he was awesome. He was such a good coach and taught me loads. He had played center in college so he knew how to be exact in his coaching.

DBN: You started as a rookie for the Browns and started all 16 games. What was the main difference between playing center in college and playing the position in the NFL?

Mack: In college, there is one guy you face each season that’s really good and is a special talent. That one guy is everybody in the NFL. Cedric Ellis was the D-tackle for USC and was highly-touted and talked about. In this NFL, he was a backup. The good thing about college is the best guy you face graduates. In the NFL, he just stays there, and you have to face him sometimes twice a year – every year.

DBN: Your rookie season, Joe Thomas was just in his second year. He said you were the smartest guy in the offensive line room. Did you see greatness in him or just a guy who couldn’t keep his weight up?

Mack: He had two Pro Bowls in his first two seasons, so he was already good. And he was still young and fresh. Very talented with a lot of success right away. I would go to him and pick his brain. He would tell you what he knew and his philosophy on it, and his teaching was well thought out for telling you why he did things the way he does. He had proven the system works. We spent enough years together that we got to be good friends.

DBN: Your second year in 2010 is the season when Peyton Hillis had that magical year with 1,177 rushing yards and scoring 11 touchdowns. As an offensive lineman, is his success considered your success?

Mack: Yeah, you take a lot of pride in the running game. And so, when you have a successful running back that does good with a lot of yards that they don’t get most of those yards on their own, you pave the way for him. When they have a good rushing game, you feel pretty good. As an offensive lineman, that is how you can control the game. When you pass block, it takes the quarterback making a good pass, the receiver catching it, us blocking so it is the whole team getting involved. If you run block effectively, you can get five yards because you have done your job.

DBN: That same year was your first Pro Bowl. Where were you when you found out?

Mack: I was in Hermosa (California) watching one of the playoff games. I was an alternate. But the way it was working was if one team won and went to the Super Bowl, I would be going to the Pro Bowl to replace that team’s center. That team won, and I got to celebrate and go to Hawai’i. Everybody in my family already knew the scenario.

Editor’s note: The Pro Bowl is played during the bye weekend between the conference championship games and the Super Bowl

DBN: By your fifth season with the Browns, you had experienced three head coaches and five starting quarterbacks with zero winning seasons. Looking back now, why did the franchise consistently have four-and five-win seasons?

Mack: I kind of point the finger at all the change. During that time, even the owners changed. With change all the time, you are firing the coach and moving around all those parts and pieces. It is hard to build a consistent level of depth. You want to hire a GM and a coach who are tied together on the same page so that they both agree on the style of football that you want and the players you are looking for. Then let’s draft and build and recruit and get the right people in here. Now, when you change that all the time, then someone drafted before might not fit your new system, so they let him go. He might be a great football player, but he doesn’t fit any longer. When you constantly fire your coach or GM, you become known as the place that doesn’t have job stability. When you have two years to make it right, then that coach knows he only has a short time and nothing beyond that or long term. And there is luck involved with the guys you draft.

DBN: Offensive linemen do get recognized individually. But out of all the position groups, why is it essential for the offensive line group to operate as one unit instead of five separate guys?

Mack: Teamwork. What I love about offensive line is you know the play, you know what’s going to happen, you know what you are trying to do, where the ball is going, and you have a lot of advantages starting off. But it relies on teamwork to build blocks and angles. Then, it is exerting your will against your opponent with that knowledge. Why it works together is because all it takes is one person to screw it up. All five of you have to take care of the five most dangerous defenders you can.

DBN: You broke your leg in 2014 against the Steelers, which broke your consecutive snap streak. Tell us about that play.

Mack: It was a big outside zone sweep to the right. Half of the field fell on me. Everyone was rushing to the right 10 yards downfield, and everyone ended up in one big pile. I ended up trying to get up and realized something was wrong. I didn’t want to look at my leg, but I knew something was bad, so I just laid down and waited on people. The trainer came out and asked what was wrong, and I told him my leg was broken. And I was right. The bone was not poking out but I broke my fibula and dislocated my foot. The ankle joint no longer held the foot together. I didn’t look at it – I didn’t want to see it. They reattached the fibula with a plate and reattached some ligament in the ankle joint. I still have the plate.

DBN: Cleveland placed the transition tag on you. Jacksonville then signed an offer sheet for five years and $42 million, which the Browns then matched. All six years in Cleveland were losing seasons for you. Jacksonville had just gone 3-13-0. Were you excited to maybe go somewhere new, or realized that the new place was a lot like the old place?

Mack: So, how it worked was after I did my five-year rookie contract, I wasn’t really happy with how the Browns were doing. I wanted to at least see the open market. I liked Cleveland, I liked what the coaches were saying. I didn’t like losing and wanted to give Cleveland another shot but I wanted to see what free agency was like. They transition tagged me, which was totally frustrating because it totally shut down any real open market. Everyone just kinda gave up. So, I had talked to Jacksonville a month after free agency started and gave them the same offer I gave Cleveland: I’ll give you five years, but I want a two-year opt-out. Both organizations wanted to get it done, even though the opt-out clause was different. And if this was working out, things are fantastic, and we are finally winning, I won’t opt-out. Cleveland didn’t want to do it, but Jacksonville said okay. Then Cleveland matched, and I played two more years.

DBN: After the 2015 season you voided those last three years on your Browns contract which had $24 million remaining, and decided to use the opt-out. Cleveland had just gone 7-9-0 and 3-13-0 those two years. Did the continual losing break you? Why did you void those years?

Mack: We just weren’t very good. (Offensive coordinator) Kyle Shanahan had left Cleveland after the 2014 season and resigned after just one year. He didn’t think they were going in the right direction, and he went to Atlanta to be their OC. We had started with success going 1-1, but lost seven in a row and 10 of our last 11 games. Again, stay with Cleveland, or I had an opportunity to sign with Atlanta and be reunited with Shanahan. I signed with Atlanta. We go to the Super Bowl and Cleveland won one game that season.

DBN: Prior to signing with the Falcons, you had visited with the Browns front office in February. You met with head coach Hue Jackson, director of football operations Sashi Brown, and new offensive line coach Hal Hunter to hear about the direction of the franchise. The talks were about your role and the new leadership’s “Vision for Winning.” After two seasons of more losing, did you leave that meeting thinking there was a turnaround coming or instead a load of BS?

Mack: For me, I was disillusioned with the constant change. The OC kept changing. With Kyle Shanahan, that was an offensive system I was good at. It was my style and played to my strengths. It could be really successful with the right people and his system. Going to Atlanta and being with Shanahan put me in a really good position to succeed as a player. That excited me. It worked because we had that great season. And, of course, when you have a really successful season, the OC gets a head coaching job, and that’s what happened. Kyle was gone again. I was excited for a fresh start in a good system that I knew and that I would be good in.

Editor’s note: After Mack left, Hue Jackson’s “Vision for Winning” went 1-15-0 in 2016 and 0-16-0 in 2017

DBN: Your next move was to sign with the Atlanta Falcons who were winners and reached Super Bowl 51. In the third quarter of that game, your team was up 28-3 before New England scored four touchdowns and a field goal. In your opinion, where did the shift begin?

Mack: It is all hard to remember because it is so shocking. I had broken my leg in the NFC Championship Game, the same leg just above the plate. The running back fell on it, and I heard it pop. They taped it and I played on it. We won the game and went to the Super Bowl. It was later confirmed to be broken. But it was a high fibula break and I was told I could play on it because it only held 10% of my weight. I think we win that game if I didn’t have a broken leg. Not that I was the reason we lost, or I would be the reason we would win. But that would have helped us play better as an offensive line. All we needed to do was make one more play and have New England make one less play, then we win that game. I think a whole two weeks of me resting that leg and not practicing just put the communication down and how we ran the offense. I gave up a sack – who knows because all of a sudden everything started to go wrong. At the same time, they made every play.

DBN: In 2021, you signed with the San Francisco 49ers, which was coming home to California for you. You lost a heart-breaker to the Los Angeles Rams 20-17 in the NFC Championship Game. As a player, which is more difficult: going to the Super Bowl or trying to get back?

Mack: The year following that Super Bowl loss with Atlanta, it struck me just how long the post-season is. That was my first taste of any playoffs, and my off-season always began early. In Cleveland, we never sniffed the playoffs, so January 2^nd you would be done. If you play in the Super Bowl, it is another six weeks of playing non-stop football against all the best teams without much rest. I went from never being in the playoffs to being in the Super Bowl, which was incredible. We got hot at the right time. Then you start all over with the conditioning and the lifting, and it just seems a lot harder doing it again.

DBN: That year, you made your seventh Pro Bowl as an alternate and was on a very good 49ers offensive team. It’s such a monumental task that takes talent and luck and timing, yet you retired. Despite being 36, you still played at an elite level. How did you come to the realization that you could retire on your own accord?

Mack: I had thought about retiring after my last year in Atlanta. I was getting older and it was getting tougher. The body changes and each year it gets harder and harder to play at a top level. Things start to wear out, and you have different pains. You realize you are declining but always want to be in the top tier. I didn’t want to just be on a team and not be a great player. The only reason to play more was to win a Super Bowl. The year before had been the COVID year and it sucked all the fun out of football. I decided to give it one more shot and followed Shanahan again, who had a team that was poised to win a Super Bowl. I’ll play for Kyle, but would only guarantee one year. I didn’t know how much more I had in the tank. Since the pandemic was so bad, play one more year and enjoy every game. I did that with a great group of guys. I loved playing in San Francisco.

DBN: You are one of the few offensive linemen who made All-Pro three times with two different franchises. Your goal coming into the league was to play 10 years, yet you played 13. What would you tell your 24-year-old rookie self?

Mack: Don’t have any regrets, and do what you want. But mainly, enjoy as much as you can and trust the process. I don’t want to bemoan Cleveland because we didn’t win games, but I really enjoyed my time there. It wasn’t boring and I played as well as I could. I put all that I had into that city. While we lost a lot of games, we played some good football. It is easy when you are winning. While losing is terrible, it teaches you to keep working.

DBN: In 2020, you were named to the NFL 2010s All-Decade Team. Who contacted you about this, and out of all the accolades you received as an NFL player, do you consider this your greatest achievement?

Mack: The media relations guy that was with Cleveland at the time called me. He said congrats – you made the All-Decade Team. I am pretty proud of that. That is a big one. Football is a tough game, and offensive line is a hard position because you are so tied to how your team performs. The bulk of my career was with a team that didn’t do as great as it should, so it showed a lot of personal achievement. It was reassuring about my career. I am a humble guy, but I would like to think that I was one of the best during my time. As far as a trophy or a plaque, I didn’t get anything, just here you were named to the All-Decades team.

DBN: Is the league still the same since you left the game?

Mack: The best advice I got as I was considering retirement is the sentiment that the game will stop, and everyone will miss you. And it doesn’t. It just keeps happening, and another schedule is made. Someone will replace you, and it keeps rolling along. I felt terrible that I was going to retire and felt like I was letting down guys who I could help win games and letting the team down. Someone else shows up and takes your place, and you are still friends with all the other guys.

DBN: One of your best friends is Joe Thomas. His Hall of Fame ceremony was a special day. What are your thoughts from that day?

Mack: Joe deserves everything that he received. A class act and a hard worker. Leveled-headed and committed. I feel lucky to have him as a friend and see him reach the level of success that he has. To see him get that recognition and be a permanent part of the Hall is awesome.

DBN: You have experience playing in a dome while with the Falcons. The Browns look like they are about to build a dome and move to Brook Park in the process. Your thoughts?

Mack: Domes are nice. It definitely is an advantage for any kicker. If you want to win games, you may want to have teams deal with your weird weather. I always thought Cleveland should have more development along the waterfront. It would be fantastic to have a lot of stuff going on with your part of the lake. But how many times is a stadium being used? Nine times a year? A dome would allow for a lot of other activities and concerts that may not get the attention of an outdoor venue.

DBN: What is your fondest moment of being a Cleveland Brown?

Mack: One year, we won the home opener. I can’t remember who we beat. Maybe the Steelers, but we had never won a home opener the entire time I was there in five years, and then won one. I remember jumping into the crowd and getting on the cover of the Plain-Dealer. And that was just one game. That was pretty cool and sticks out. In my rookie year, we started 1-11 and were awful, and then we decided we were just going to run the ball and won the final four games and had a great time playing. That was a really fun streak, and wondered why we couldn’t just do that all the time. After my first year, I realized I could play, but going to my first Pro Bowl on a team that didn’t win many games, I was proud of myself. To get that recognition from a losing team and from the other players in the league was special for me and made me proud to be a part of Cleveland.

Editor’s note: After losing to the Steelers in Week 1 of the 2014 season, the Browns beat the New Orleans Saints 26-24 in their home opener in front of 67,407 patrons with a game-time temperature of 61 degrees as K Billy Cundiff nailed a 29-yard field goal with :03 left in the game.

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